ACTA.

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Blood Raven
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ACTA.

Postby Blood Raven » Fri Aug 13, 2010 4:12 pm

Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement. How does this affect you and me? Well, in many ways.

ACTA will allow the government/officials to search your computer/Ipods/MP3s at random, without reason. They can also confiscate those items if they wish. ACTA allows them to block websites deemed "unacceptable". ACTA will ban p2p clients, like uTorrent. ACTA will allow ISPs to PERMANENTLY Ban you from using the internet, without a trial. As you can see, this whole thing is bollocks, and we must do everything possible to stop this. Granted, no voting on the issue is allowed. But we can protest.

Here's some info/websites.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Counterfeiting_Trade_Agreement
http://www.anti-acta.com/
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Anti-ACTA/106175812744911?v=wall
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/03/europe-trashes-acta-as-obama-praises-it.ars

Maybe email news networks about this, get it out there. Because the government(s) is keeping the public in the dark about this.

Won't affect you? Have you ever ripped a CD onto your computer? Boom, they got you for that. Downloaded Photoshop off of UTorrent? Blam. Searched for a free mp3 of a song, but never downloaded it? Boom, still got you. This is a severe violation of human rights, and I just thought I'd tell you guys about it.
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Scaveleon
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Scaveleon » Fri Aug 13, 2010 5:24 pm

The point of the internet is to share stuff. I don't mean illegally, but even now we're sharing words.

If this gets signed by USA, I'm unplugging my stationary computer and I'll use my clean laptop.
Last edited by Scaveleon on Fri Aug 13, 2010 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Automatically merged double post.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Blood Raven » Fri Aug 13, 2010 7:01 pm

Scaveleon wrote:The point of the internet is to share stuff. I don't mean illegally, but even now we're sharing words.

If this gets signed by USA, I'm unplugging my stationary computer and I'll use my clean laptop.


Indeed, but still, China has done this, and it hasn't stopped them at all.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby TheRunner » Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:18 pm

Hopefully Canadians are in the clear.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby patatoface » Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:41 pm

this dosen't sound good for a lot of people at all
i once dowloaded winrar off some website, could they get me for that?

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Deedasmi » Sat Aug 14, 2010 12:12 am

No, winrar is a free program. It always works despite saying that you need to buy it. And this is aimed at people who torrent, and illegally download things, which can be good. I'm doing some research on it now to see if they can randomly search without reason, because that is a no-no. And is easily unconstitutional.

and btw runner, from the wikipeadia article, canada is a major backing of this.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Blood Raven » Sat Aug 14, 2010 7:46 pm

Deedasmi wrote:No, winrar is a free program. It always works despite saying that you need to buy it. And this is aimed at people who torrent, and illegally download things, which can be good. I'm doing some research on it now to see if they can randomly search without reason, because that is a no-no. And is easily unconstitutional.

and btw runner, from the wikipeadia article, canada is a major backing of this.


They could pass some regulation through a committee congress has no control of. Or they could justify it using Commerce Clause. If they want to do it, truthfully, they can find a way to make it happen.

Also, I agree with you about the illegal stuff, but still, suing someone over putting music on their mp3 from a CD is just flat out ridiculous.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Ixayou » Sat Aug 14, 2010 7:57 pm

Will this affect my country too? :O I hope they dont do it here, and if they do then im out of here
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Zhuge » Sat Aug 14, 2010 8:13 pm

Heh, it's so hard to catch people torrenting. They'd literally need people to sit on popular torrents record the IP addresses so your ISP can rat you out. Even then, it probably wouldn't be very effective in most cases.
No matter what they do, people will find a way to get around this stuff. I mean, even if it comes down to people bootlegging crap and buying them from that sketchy dude's van downtown, they'll still do it, like some do now. :P

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Re: ACTA.

Postby RPGking » Sat Aug 14, 2010 8:30 pm

If pirating and torrenting was such a bad thign somethign would've been doen and sealed by now, this is another one of the failed propagandas that nobody will pay any attention too. So what soemone downlaods a coupel copies of GTA, hasn't Rockstar made enough, so what someoen downloads a movie that made 1.5 million dollars. Are these companies so petty that they'll practically shut down the internets traficking to earn a few more bucks. Sure it adds up but not by much.

Peopel willf idn ways aroudn this, they always do, and when it comes down to it, torrentign and stuff liek that will never die.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Blood Raven » Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:26 pm

Zhuge wrote:Heh, it's so hard to catch people torrenting. They'd literally need people to sit on popular torrents record the IP addresses so your ISP can rat you out. Even then, it probably wouldn't be very effective in most cases.
No matter what they do, people will find a way to get around this stuff. I mean, even if it comes down to people bootlegging crap and buying them from that sketchy dude's van downtown, they'll still do it, like some do now. :P


Doesn't matter if they actually catch you, with this they can take your computer if they even suspect you of it.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Inxth » Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:48 pm

Which is something that I believe we would be completely against.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Zhuge » Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:55 pm

Heh, that means they could just take anyone's computer anytime they want. :P
That'll probably be revised.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Deedasmi » Sun Aug 15, 2010 1:20 am

RPGking, you do realist it costs 10+ million dollars to design a game right? Most movies are over a million too.

Btw, GTA IV was put at a 100 million dollar budget according to most sources.

The guy that made avatar started his ideas in 1982. Development of the movie started in 1994. This guy designed his own Camera to shoot this one movie. Twenty seven years of this guys life. How much do you think he lost to torrents?

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Re: ACTA.

Postby RPGking » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:32 am

As far as I'm concerned. They ahve enough money and theres people without it who want to expirence stuf fliek that too. Most people even use torrents as a test before they buy something.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Scaveleon » Sun Aug 15, 2010 4:42 am

Ixayou wrote:Will this affect my country too? :O I hope they dont do it here, and if they do then im out of here

Countries affected by this treaty include but are not limited to: Australia, Canada, the European Union, Japan, The Republic of Korea, Mexico, Morocco, New Zealand, Singapore, Switzerland and the United States


Your country is not a part of the European Union, but somewhat associated with it in trade. However, you'll never know what can happen - You might be living in a time bomb'd location.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Gamerdude » Sun Aug 15, 2010 5:05 am

So then should we be concerned? Could they get us? Or is it for people after the ACTA is in effect?
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Re: ACTA.

Postby Scaveleon » Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:01 am

Yes, we should be concerned no matter who we are.

ACTA has from its very start in 2008 been kept secret from the public. The government knows that the public won't like it, therefore they will probably proceed with ACTA agreements without public vote. The government shouldn't be allowed to do this without the consent of the public.

If this is implemented, the common people will owe billions of dollars to suers, suing companies and the like. You can be sued for 125.000 dollars in USA for downloading a song, and ACTA still want the penalty for this to be harsher. We'd practically be enslaved to the government because everyone would owe them so much money.

And ACTA stands above any local laws. This means that ACTA allows random people to penalize citizens without any evidence or trials. Consider that the suers will get so much money and items, it'll easily lead to corruption and theft of home property worldwide. On the long run, ACTA will allow random people do whatever they want with your electronics and demand money. Even if you have right to protest by local laws, ACTA won't allow you to.

So in conclusion, this is business for the government. But it won't only have financial costs, it will also cost human lives.

Once ACTA is implemented, the medicine transportation will have to be checked thoroughly. It would prevent smuggling temporarily, but it'll mean that common medicine transportations will be delayed, and this will cost lots of lives worldwide.

Lastly, anything ACTA wants to prevent will always find another way. China's government is fighting piracy, yet China still manages to be one of the leaders of piracy. So anything the ACTA prevents is temporary, and a workaround will be done with new cult technology and methods. However the damage ACTA will cause to common people is permanent.

ACTA is fixing a temporary problems with permanent solutions. That's equivalent to suicide!
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Re: ACTA.

Postby RPGking » Sun Aug 15, 2010 12:54 pm

I saw somethign about this on FOX news, the analyst was syaing it sproablably goign to be over ruled and heavily editted. if theres no evidence supporting illegal downloading etc. they can't do crap, it sjust beign blown out fo proportion. he gave a potential reason why it could eb over throwed because ACTA can't prosecute or penalize anyone because they have no evidence and don't know who was at the computer at the time.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby SBG » Sun Aug 15, 2010 5:24 pm

Deedasmi wrote:RPGking, you do realist it costs 10+ million dollars to design a game right? Most movies are over a million too.

Btw, GTA IV was put at a 100 million dollar budget according to most sources.

The guy that made avatar started his ideas in 1982. Development of the movie started in 1994. This guy designed his own Camera to shoot this one movie. Twenty seven years of this guys life. How much do you think he lost to torrents?

I hope that's not an excuse to support this act. Piracy is just a pretext for this legislation, and it will not stop it. What it WILL do is allow governments to confiscate and tear apart any piece of data storage you have for any reason or no reason at all. It's a violation of human rights and everyone is at risk of this tyranny whether you pirate illegal content or not.

And if they actually log you in the act of pirating, they will break into your home and rob you of all your electronics at gunpoint. It's simply a violation of human rights in the interest of the rich and powerful. Just another way for them to keep the common man in serfdom.

Also Avatar was one of the highest grossing movies of all time. Movies are making more money than ever now. Piracy is hardly a speedbump in their profits.

And to top it off, actors are also making record wages these days. They are getting paid tens of millions of dollars for simply spending a little bit of time in front of a camera and essentially lying for a living. That is INSANE in my opinion. You've got people that risk their lives everyday doing nearly impossible jobs, and they still can hardly afford to feed themselves with interest rates and the price of everything going up, yet you have people like Tom Cruise who spend a couple days a week for a few months LYING in front of a camera and make over 20 million dollars for doing it. There is something seriously wrong with that situation.

The government needs to do the reverse of this act. Instead of locking the common poor people up and catering to the out of control entertainment industry, they need to regulate the entertainment industry and make entertainment more accessible to those who cannot afford it. That way, you stop piracy and you stop the insane hypocrisy that is the entertainment industry. Of course that would never happen because it's not the most profitable idea, and this whole thing is all about the $$$. Can you imagine how much money the government and the entertainment industry is going to be making by charging everyone who has pirated content on their computer? It makes me sick. "Screw the little guy. Take his money and give it to the people who are already swimming in money." :evil:

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Re: ACTA.

Postby RPGking » Sun Aug 15, 2010 5:39 pm

Exactly my point.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Blood Raven » Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:13 pm

SBG wrote:
Deedasmi wrote:RPGking, you do realist it costs 10+ million dollars to design a game right? Most movies are over a million too.

Btw, GTA IV was put at a 100 million dollar budget according to most sources.

The guy that made avatar started his ideas in 1982. Development of the movie started in 1994. This guy designed his own Camera to shoot this one movie. Twenty seven years of this guys life. How much do you think he lost to torrents?

I hope that's not an excuse to support this act. Piracy is just a pretext for this legislation, and it will not stop it. What it WILL do is allow governments to confiscate and tear apart any piece of data storage you have for any reason or no reason at all. It's a violation of human rights and everyone is at risk of this tyranny whether you pirate illegal content or not.

And if they actually log you in the act of pirating, they will break into your home and rob you of all your electronics at gunpoint. It's simply a violation of human rights in the interest of the rich and powerful. Just another way for them to keep the common man in serfdom.

Also Avatar was one of the highest grossing movies of all time. Movies are making more money than ever now. Piracy is hardly a speedbump in their profits.

And to top it off, actors are also making record wages these days. They are getting paid tens of millions of dollars for simply spending a little bit of time in front of a camera and essentially lying for a living. That is INSANE in my opinion. You've got people that risk their lives everyday doing nearly impossible jobs, and they still can hardly afford to feed themselves with interest rates and the price of everything going up, yet you have people like Tom Cruise who spend a couple days a week for a few months LYING in front of a camera and make over 20 million dollars for doing it. There is something seriously wrong with that situation.

The government needs to do the reverse of this act. Instead of locking the common poor people up and catering to the out of control entertainment industry, they need to regulate the entertainment industry and make entertainment more accessible to those who cannot afford it. That way, you stop piracy and you stop the insane hypocrisy that is the entertainment industry. Of course that would never happen because it's not the most profitable idea, and this whole thing is all about the $$$. Can you imagine how much money the government and the entertainment industry is going to be making by charging everyone who has pirated content on their computer? It makes me sick. "Screw the little guy. Take his money and give it to the people who are already swimming in money." :evil:


You had me agreeing with you until you started bashing Avatar's Creator and actors.

The guy spent a lot of his life working on that movie, he deserves as much as he can get. As for getting paid to lie, no, it's called acting. I bet you can't act near as well as Tom Cruise. Yes, the movie industry needs that money, they spend millions making that movie that you go watch for an hour and a half, and a lot of the time they barely make a few million profit. Some fail to even make a profit at all. Piracy is a hell of a bump in the industry. People in the music and film industry lose their jobs every year because you're too cheap to put out $15 for a measly dvd or CD.

This is the way society has always been, there will be rich, and there will be not so rich. There have to be people working those minimum wage jobs for you to keep living the way you do. It's the way things are.

Unless you wish for us to live in a Communist government, where everyone will make the same, no matter what. But a lot of things you enjoy would be gone if that happened.

Piracy needs to be abolished, I agree with them on that, but there are different ways to go about doing it then this.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby SBG » Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:38 pm

I never bashed Avatar or it's creators or actors, I simply stated that it was one of the highest grossing movies of all time, even in the age of piracy.

And acting in it's definition is pretending to be something you're not, essentially lying. Sure it requires some skill and personality traits, but it's truly not HARD work, if you even know what hard work is. Definitely not worthy of making millions and millions of dollars per film. That's the actors, not the creators. They deserve every penny they get. And you know, if the actors didn't demand a crazy sum of money, then maybe the movies wouldn't cost a crazy sum of money to make. Leave Avatar out of that one because I know most of the budget went to the effects, but you can't say the same for every other movie. I still can't give Avatar too much credit though as far as the story goes. Ever seen Pocahontas?

Also Tom Cruise is NOT a good actor :lol:

One more thing. I never said I was a pirate so don't put words in my mouth please and thank you.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Blood Raven » Sun Aug 15, 2010 10:10 pm

SBG wrote:I never bashed Avatar or it's creators or actors, I simply stated that it was one of the highest grossing movies of all time, even in the age of piracy.

And acting in it's definition is pretending to be something you're not, essentially lying. Sure it requires some skill and personality traits, but it's truly not HARD work, if you even know what hard work is. Definitely not worthy of making millions and millions of dollars per film. That's the actors, not the creators. They deserve every penny they get. And you know, if the actors didn't demand a crazy sum of money, then maybe the movies wouldn't cost a crazy sum of money to make. Leave Avatar out of that one because I know most of the budget went to the effects, but you can't say the same for every other movie. I still can't give Avatar too much credit though as far as the story goes. Ever seen Pocahontas?

Also Tom Cruise is NOT a good actor :lol:

One more thing. I never said I was a pirate so don't put words in my mouth please and thank you.


There is more than the actors' payments that go into the cost of a movie. You have to pay for stuntmen, camera crews, equipment, renting space/vehicles, food and drink for the crews, special effects, and more. Besides, it's usually the movie directors who approach the actors with the sum of money, not the actors asking for it.

Because you do not like Tom Cruise does not make him a bad actor. I hate Michael Cera with a passion, but I won't deny he acts better than me.

Maybe you aren't a pirate, but you came off strongly as one in your post.

Now, let's get back onto what we were supposed to be discussing.
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Re: ACTA.

Postby SBG » Sun Aug 15, 2010 10:57 pm

Honestly my beef is just with the amount of money that certain actors make. I agree everyone else in the production deserves everything they should get because they work hard, but they don't get nearly as much as the actors, whos job is to talk in front of a camera. There's no reason actors should be making 1000x more than anyone else involved in the production.

Back on topic... I've already said my 2 cents, but I'll reiterate. ACTA is wrong and taking things to the extreme. There's gotta be a better way. Instead of placing the blame on the common people, make the industries conform to a changing industry. We didn't have the Industrial Revolution by keeping things the same.

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Re: ACTA.

Postby Scaveleon » Mon Aug 16, 2010 3:47 am

The money used to make money is used to make a movie, which makes money, which you use to make more movies, and so on.

The real problem is the end product; The director will be swimming in millions once he retires.
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